Brain training that cured a real illness: first-person testimony about fully recovering from [ME/CFS] using the lightning process, 2026, Hartman et al

[Tom Hill]

I am not against anybody using mindbody/Bret to help with symptoms, just no claims /implied claims about the rest of us

This

 

[Chandelier]

Whoa!

Also see our thread:
Lightning Process: Evidence that participants are taught or expected to misrepresent or lie about their symptoms

 

[Tom Hill]

They just know it is true, and thus are justified in weakening methodological standards and relentlessly torturing the data until it confesses that truth, to the point of even just blatantly lying about what it says, and running a shameless marketing campaign to convince the skeptical world of it.

“Infinite are the arguments of mages”
Ursula K. Le Guin

 

[MrMagoo]

My spidey senses are tingling so hard but no matter what I try, I can't make a direct connection to Alan Levinovitz from any of the presenters.

I've been going through the publication lists of the participants of that gathering and this study title by de Punder et al made me laugh, so I thought I'd share the fun:

Looking back at my academia years, I could have written so much bollocks with the goal to one day show it to my children and have a laugh, but alas!

I’m about to go full “ Pepe Silvia does not exist”* I have post it’s and string and highlighters you know!

I guess that poster who popped up to defend Garner who said they were worried about us all, because of what’s coming up, meant that since the Choo Choo gang had a probably COFFI or coffee gathering the other year to plan infiltration of journals, and promotion of plastic brainery and a gold standard ME and LC cure in the edit, we would all be weeping into our biomedical cornflakes each morning.

They do seem to be a bunch of people who can’t hold their own ner-ner raspberry blows.

*Its Always Sunny in Philadelphia meme where worker tries to investigate whether someone actually exists and goes half mad tying evidence together

 

[Tom Hill]

Also see our thread:
Lightning Process: Evidence that participants are taught or expected to misrepresent or lie about their symptoms

Thank you!

I am fascinated by this. I did some work a few years ago on radicalization in certain apostolic reformation (a branch of evangelical) churches in America. I met people who’d escaped these cult like places who told me stories of how aggressive faith healing rituals during services was used to police and tread on people who remained unwell. It was a sign they didn’t believe hard enough or had insufficient faith. This reached levels beyond satire: I interviewed one woman who had been born deaf in one ear and with only one leg. She was subjected to weekly aggressive mob yelling over her body and was scorned for failing to grow a second leg!

Sounds like the same authoritarian cult dynamics.

Edit: apologies if this accidentally breaks comment rules. Not lambasting any religion. Just certain attempts at medical outcomes that psychologically harm disabled people.

 

[skronen]

My spidey senses are tingling so hard but no matter what I try, I can't make a direct connection to Alan Levinovitz from any of the presenters.

Becca Kennedy was featured in the WIRED article, no?

 

[MrMagoo]

Thank you!

I am fascinated by this. I did some work a few years ago on radicalization in certain apostolic reformation (a branch of evangelical) churches in America. I met people who’d escaped these cult like places who told me stories of how aggressive faith healing rituals during services was used to police and tread on people who remained unwell. It was a sign they didn’t believe hard enough or had insufficient faith. This reached levels beyond satire: I interviewed one woman who had been born deaf in one ear and with only one leg. She was subjected to weekly aggressive mob yelling over her body and was scorned for failing to grow a second leg!

Sounds like the same authoritarian cult dynamics.

Edit: apologies if this accidentally breaks comment rules. Not lambasting any religion. Just certain attempts at medical outcomes that psychologically harm disabled people.

There is an intersection with religion/faith, and also MLM (which intersects with religion) and high-demand groups (which also intersects with religion and MLM).
Being really theoretical about it, it probably wouldn’t meet much of the criteria for a cult, but in conversational parlance rather than academic I’d say it’s cult-like, for the reasons above.

I’m sure someone will be along soon to tell us they feel sorry for us because they were cured by BR (brain retrain) and we are all big meanies for saying it’s questionable.

 

[Chandelier]

I am fascinated by this. I did some work a few years ago on radicalization in certain apostolic reformation (a branch of evangelical) churches in America.

Oh, you might be in for a treat with the Alan Levinovitz (AL), Professor of Religion, thread then:

Tern on X posted this about AL and his religious experiences: fire shooting hands, seeing cafe workers as demons and more.

 

[MrMagoo]

Oh, you might be in for a treat with the Alan Levinovitz (AL), Professor of Religion, thread then:

That’s not half as entertaining as when he turned up here in the thread about his WIRED article, wanting a debate (but not about his article, not willing to discuss)

 

[Chandelier]

I guess that poster who popped up to defend Garner who said they were worried about us all, because of what’s coming up, meant that since the Choo Choo gang had a COFFI gathering the other year to plan infiltration of journals, and promotion of plastic brainery and a gold standard ME and LC cure in the edit, we would all be weeping into our biomedical cornflakes each morning.

@Tom Hill I'm trying to point you in the right direction in case you want to look this up.
Mr. Magoo talks about the last time we were visited by a selfless helping angel from the BPS brigades.
What a legendary and classy exit from a forum full of chronically ill people!

This is probably a good time for me to step away from this thread just because some of the sneering is a bit much.

Good to talk to you all. The saddest thing for me about these kinds of discussions is I get to shut my laptop down and do whatever I want (e.g go for a run and get some work done plus see friends in one day) and I'm very conscious you don't. I attribute that to the brain retraining work I did, even if you say there is currently not the evidence to support that assertion. I spent years also stuck indoors/in bed/feeling imprisoned and hated it. I don't think M.E will ever boil down to a very black and white 'this is the evidence.' Clinical experience of recoveries stretches back a good 25 years, that's doctors who have treated thousands of patients and seen them recover. That counts for something, too, in my book.

 

[Chandelier]

That’s not half as entertaining as when he turned up here in the thread about his WIRED article wanting a debate (but not about his article, not willing to discuss)

Let's face it: the whole thread of ~8 trillion pages is a masterpiece.
Take one post away and an angel somewhere in heaven will cry — facts!

 

[bobbler]

Trial By Error: Journal of Psychosomatic Research Publishes First-Person Account of "Cure" with the Lightning Process | Virology Blog

By David Tuller, DrPH The Journal of Psychosomatic Research (JPR), an official publication of the European Association of Psychosomatic Medicine (EAPM), has ...

virology.ws

Oh forgot to say great article - was so focused on not forgetting what I was trying to remember between screens but spotted the following

4th para there is a c missing from retrospective

4th para from the end there is an open bracket but I can’t see the closing one