Elevated ATG13 in serum of pwME stimulates oxidative stress response in microglial cells , 2022, Gottschalk et al

Discussion in 'ME/CFS research' started by Sly Saint, Oct 1, 2021.

  1. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    For the abstract of the published paper, go to post #9


    Preprint


    Abstract

    Myalgic Encephalomyelitis and chronic fatigue syndrome is a multisystem illness characterized with extreme muscle fatigue associated with pain, neurocognitive impairment, and chronic inflammation. Despite intense investigation, the molecular mechanism of this disease is still unknown. Here we report two independent case-control studies to demonstrate that autophagy proteins are strongly upregulated in the serum of ME/CFS patients indicative of severe impairment in metabolic events of autophagy.

    Serum samples collected from two healthy and two age-matched patients were assayed for protein aggregation, screened for autophagy-related factors via an antibody array, quantified with densitometric analyses, and finally reconfirmed with ELISA analyses. Based on that double-blinded and gender-balanced study, the levels of ATG13, p62, and alpha-synuclein (α-syn) were found to be consistently elevated in the serum samples of these two ME/CFS patients.

    Moreover, our microglia-based oxidative stress response study and nitrite analyses indicated that serum samples of ME/CFS patients evoked the production of reactive oxygen species (ROS) and nitrite in human HMC3 microglial cells, whereas neutralization of ATG13 was shown to strongly diminish the production of ROS and nitrite demonstrating the de novo effect bloodborne autophagy factors on inducing the stress response in microglial cells. Collectively, our results indicate that the impairment of autophagy followed by upregulations of autophagy markers especially ATG13 in serum could be a pathological hallmark in ME/CFS.

    https://www.researchsquare.com/article/rs-925403/v1
     
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  2. Hoopoe

    Hoopoe Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  3. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I am struggling to see how they hope to publish a paper on two patients?
     
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  4. Ravn

    Ravn Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Poorly written abstract. The paper actually consists of two parts.

    The first is about the 2 case controls mentioned in the abstract.

    The second is a follow up with 12 patients and 12 controls - not mentioned in the abstract - to further validate the main findings around ATG13 found in the first part.

    Without understanding the biochemistry, together the results look interesting enough to warrant further investigation into ATG13?
     
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  5. Ravn

    Ravn Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Or maybe not just into ATG13 but into possible problems with cell death more generally? ATG13 is linked to autophagy in this paper. A different team* found elevated anti-apoptotic IL9 (in female pwME only, preliminary data from very few patients - again again, sigh).

    Autophagy and apoptosis are thought to be linked though nobody seems to be sure how exactly - and that's even before throwing ME into the mix. :emoji_thinking:

    *discussed in this thread: https://www.s4me.info/threads/nih-2...work-on-altered-t-cells-in-me-cfs-2021.19726/
     
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  6. Hoopoe

    Hoopoe Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Physical exercise is one thing that induces autophagy.
     
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  7. SNT Gatchaman

    SNT Gatchaman Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    If anyone is interested in a simplified overview of the mechanisms underlying autophagy (and its potential induction via intermittent fasting), Dr Been released a video today on his channel.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KzyoEFgQec




    Discusses aspects such as how the immune system can be repaired from dysfunction and how viral proteins that are sequestered in cells but doing harm can be broken down, and subsequently presented for immune recognition and action.
     
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  8. Boba

    Boba Established Member

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  9. Mij

    Mij Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Merged thread - published paper

    Elevated ATG13 in serum of pwME stimulates oxidative stress response in microglial cells via activation of receptor for advanced glycation end products(RAGE), 2022, GunnarGottschalk et al


    Abstract


    Myalgic Encephalomyelitis, also known as Chronic Fatigue Syndrome (ME/CFS), is a multisystem illness characterized by extreme muscle fatigue associated with pain, neurocognitive impairment, and chronic inflammation. Despite intense investigation, the molecular mechanism of this disease is still unknown.

    Here we demonstrate that autophagy-related protein ATG13 is strongly upregulated in the serum of ME/CFS patients, indicative of impairment in the metabolic events of autophagy. A Thioflavin T-based protein aggregation assay, array screening for autophagy-related factors, densitometric analyses, and confirmation with ELISA revealed that the level of ATG13 was strongly elevated in serum samples of ME/CFS patients compared to age-matched controls. Moreover, our microglia-based oxidative stress response experiments indicated that serum samples of ME/CFS patients evoke the production of reactive oxygen species (ROS) and nitric oxide in human HMC3 microglial cells, whereas neutralization of ATG13 strongly diminishes the production of ROS and NO, suggesting that ATG13 plays a role in the observed stress response in microglial cells.

    Finally, an in vitro ligand binding assay provided evidence that ATG13 employs the Receptor for Advanced Glycation End-products (RAGE) to stimulate ROS in microglial cells. Collectively, our results suggest that an impairment of autophagy following the release of ATG13 into serum could be a pathological signal in ME/CFS.

    https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1044743122000379
     
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  10. Slamdancin

    Slamdancin Established Member

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  11. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Unless people are prepared to put some actual data in the abstract I am unenthusiastic about trying to wade through. I seem to be able to access a half paper with some 'snippets'. It all seems like deliberate obfuscation purely for the benefit of those making money out of the publication process.

    If the findings are meaningful they could be very important but if they are why not show them?
     
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  12. Boba

    Boba Established Member

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    Here’s some part of the data. Not all patients had elevated ATG13. 2 Controls were elevated as well.
     

    Attached Files:

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  13. Jonathan Edwards

    Jonathan Edwards Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thanks. That seems a pretty bizarre way to present data of this sort. Not sure what negative concentrations are supposed to be!
     
  14. LarsSG

    LarsSG Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    There does seem to be some interesting findings in here, though with very small n.

    If I'm understanding correctly, they took patient and control serum and added it to microglial cells in vitro and found the ME patient serum caused reactive oxygen species (ROS) to increase significantly more than control serum did (but this was only two patients and two controls). Then they removed as much ATG13 from patient serum as they could and found significantly less ROS, about the same as controls (this part was n=6, plus the initial two subjects).

    upload_2022-4-27_18-13-37.png ,
    Then they found pretty similar results for patient serum, control serum and patient serum with ATG13 removed for nitric oxide production in microglial cells.

    upload_2022-4-27_18-18-25.png
    Then they did something to neutralize RAGE and found that it significantly reduced ROS.

    But the ATG13 levels were all over the map for controls and patients (and I'm also confused by the negative concentrations). Their initial two patients only had ATG13 around 5ng/ml, while 25% of controls had levels around 4 or 5. I wonder if something is going on with that table though, because Figure 3 seems to be presenting the same data, but it obviously isn't the same.

    It's not really clear to me how they got such strong results if ATG13 is not that different in patients versus controls, but then it isn't clear which patients and which controls were used for these charts. This seems strange.

    This is all way over my head, but interesting to see more findings on oxidative stress.
     
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  15. LarsSG

    LarsSG Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  16. Hoopoe

    Hoopoe Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    The author says on Twitter that Atg13 in serum is “result” of autophagy impairment, not the “cause”.

    Autophagy was initially discovered by studying starvation, then later it was also found to play a major role in homeostasis. Autophagy sounds like the kind of maintenance process that might be involved in PEM.
     
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  17. Hutan

    Hutan Moderator Staff Member

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    This interview is a bit relevant - there is a transcript. Norman Swan talking to Professor Luigi Fontana about research on extending human lifespan. Professor Fontana is keen on calorie restriction.
    https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/healthreport/the-lowdown-on-longevity/13850872

    I recall that it has been said that ME/CFS looks metabolically like starvation - I don't recall the details or if it's likely to be true. But, Professor Fontana is saying calorie restriction promotes autophagy. Atg13 is important in inducing autophagy. And here, the authors are reporting that Atg13 is upregulated in people with ME/CFS.


    I don't think 'all over the map' is quite true, if the data above are correct. If you ignore the patient without CFS (just SFN -small fibre neuropathy?), then 10 out of the 11 CFS patients have high values, and 10 of the 12 controls have low values. That's probably as good as we could expect. But yeah, the negative concentrations?
     
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  18. Hutan

    Hutan Moderator Staff Member

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    (I'm working with the snippets only.)

    So, they tested for 20 autophagy-related proteins in two patients and two controls, and presumably found just ATG13 was different. They then validated the result of elevated ATG13 with 10 or so more patients and controls.
    I'm assuming the story they are suggesting is:
    1. there's an accumulation of faulty mitochondria (and other debris) in a cell.
    2. Levels of ATG13 increase, to start the clean-up process.
    3. For some reason, the clean-up process doesn't happen
    4. Levels of ATG13 increase to keep signalling for the clean-up that never comes

    But then, there's also the story of the ATG13 in the patient serum seeming to cause a production of reactive oxygen species, while the ATG13 in the control serum does not. So, is there something different about the ATG13 in ME/CFS patients? Perhaps a faulty ATG13 is in fact the cause of the autophagy not happening, as well as the ROS. (The comment from Twitter seems to suggest the authors have another theory.)

    If ATG13 is important in immunity against pathogens as well as in initiating autophagy, then perhaps some pathogens have evolved to hobble the ATG13?
     
  19. Hutan

    Hutan Moderator Staff Member

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    As @Slamdancin suggested above, there's the fact that viral infections cause ATG13 expression to be increased.

    See for example:
    Antiviral responses of ATG13 to the infection of peste des petits ruminants virus through activation of interferon response, 2020, Ma et al
    So, an alternative story might be that the ATG13 is increased in the serum of people with ME/CFS because their cells have been infected by a virus (or at least the cells or some other part of the body think they have been infected).

    One thing to think about is that higher levels of ATG13 in the serum is not the same as higher levels of ATG13 in the cell. ATG13 might not be higher in the cells of people with ME/CFS compared to the controls. Maybe ME/CFS cells are self-destructing and releasing their ATG13 into the blood?
     
    Last edited: Apr 28, 2022
  20. SNT Gatchaman

    SNT Gatchaman Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I don't know for sure, but I wonder whether it's an offset from a virtual control as they are measuring via optical density.

     
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