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They might have wanted to show they had looked at all of the crap - even if you're correct i.e. they should have said it's crap and here's why--- would have raised a few hackles --- disgruntled X---

Well to be fair, if you were in NICE, and you had to answer for the mess, then it would be reasonable to ask for the money to do the job properly.

I used to drink wine and relied on XYZ--- to guide my (cheap) choices NICE should be able to evaluate evidence and, as @Jonathan Edwards points out, the reasons why X was adopted should be set out --- transparent. NICE shouldn't need Cochrane particularly since it's a pile of poo - and NICE...

As I've pointed out before I haven't followed this carefully. Let's say @Jonathan Edwards has done a study in rheumatoid arthritis using rituximab. Patients were selected using objective measures (e.g. antibody levels and scans), their level of disability was assessed using an objective...

Yes the "beauty" of what they do is note the remarkable consistency of studies which do not have objective outcome measures, and are unblinded, -- they then ignore the question is this the Hawthorne effect [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawthorne_effect]. If you show an interest in people they...

Yea surely a medical Doctor who is unsure of a diagnosis can set out their views and ask a colleague(s) for their views? Black boxes (like GRADE) are rightly concerning - the fact that this one requires you to give a +ve value to data that should be discarded, means that it isn't fit for...

It may not be that different from the Hawthorne effect https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawthorne_effect indeed @Jonathan Edwards advice that he showed empathy to his patients and tried to support them --- OK Jonathan was developing treatments that worked rather than just being interested!

I assume he's a medical Doctor in which case he's disowned his training. If 100 people get I'll and 90 recover - the reasons the others don't might be genetic, --- If one person turned up at his clinic and announced their recovery was the "power of the Lord Jesus" [I'm in Northern Ireland]...

If the "retired believers" are those who spent their "professional/work" life in this then they presumably have a vested interested in believing it had a purpose.

Never used a chiropractor but they have a reputation - not a validated part of medicine - very lucrative ---- seems like there's a theme here ---- on (his) upside I guess he's well paid even if those on the other side of the equation (us) don't benefit from his services!

I live in Northern Ireland [UK devolved administration] and vaguely recall having a brief exchange with the Health Committee i.e. re NICE guidance. I wasn't impressed that they referred to NICE guidance; I pointed out they didn't have to go with it - since health is a devolved matter. The...

The cost of going to Court alone should force a rethink - at a wild guess I can't imagine it would be less than £100K. Not sure there's anyone in the mix who would put up the money. An insurance company should have "good" retained legal advisors and I guess they'd be advising not to go there -...

Someone blessed with good health ---you too could be like me --- if you pay for X. Y, Z---distasteful!

I wonder if part of the problem here is that Universities expect researchers to bring in money oh and some researchers might want to earn some extra cash. I haven't been following this closely so I had to Google "ebm programme at mcmaster university" laughed/gritted my teeth/shook my head when...

Yip "right" but not "right enough" sums it up! However, in this case it's those who oppose the revised guidance who have to go through the court ---. I work in planning policy [UK devolved administration] but I'm not a signed up believer --- more a failed chemistry technician actually!

I was only commenting generally e.g. if you found out that the brother in law, of the person making a decision, benefitted from that particular outcome, then I assume the Court would grant a judicial review - in effect voiding the guidance. I don't follow this issue closely but people in...

I'm no expert but part of the difficult here is the question the court asks e.g. is the decision so perverse that no reasonable person could come to that conclusion based on the evidence? Or e.g. is the decision void because the decision maker was not independent - conflict of interest? That's...

I'm no expert, and I haven't even followed this closely, but I wouldn't recommend that the psychological bunch challenged the revised NICE guidance. I think they'd have to prove that no reasonable person could possibly come to that conclusion [Wednesbury unreasonable] --- a difficult argument...

Thanks @Jonathan Edwards From the outside these people seem to be relying on something akin to religion i.e. they have a truth but it cannot be measured -- we'll it can but the base objective measurements don't confirm the truth so they have to be cast aside in favour of the subjective ---...

Thanks & for the laugh - as always!