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Pulse: "Revealed: How patients referred to mental health services end up back with their GP"

Discussion in 'Other health news and research' started by Andy, Nov 26, 2018.

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  1. Andy

    Andy Committee Member

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    http://www.pulsetoday.co.uk/clinica...es-end-up-back-with-their-gp/20037700.article
     
    Andy, Nov 26, 2018
    #1
    Arnie Pye, Sean, inox and 14 others like this.
  2. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    And yet we have this nonsense:

    https://twitter.com/user/status/1065882223688249344


    So, half of half is a success story that is just about the same as 50% success (hardly a glowing success when you're at random chance levels). As long as you massage this half and don't bother looking too deeply about what it means to be recovered, which likely includes people who simply don't come back because it was utterly useless to their case.

    Reminds me of when Trump lost a critical vote in Congress. He argued that if you don't count the votes against, they nearly had 100% of the votes.

    Galactic brains here.
     
    rvallee, Nov 26, 2018
    #2
    Arnie Pye, Chezboo, TiredSam and 10 others like this.
  3. DokaGirl

    DokaGirl Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thanks for your analysis, @rvallee.

    Seems to be the new, new math these institutions are using.
     
    DokaGirl, Nov 26, 2018
    #3
    Arnie Pye, rvallee, ladycatlover and 5 others like this.
  4. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

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    The Mental Elf sees it all through special BPS rose tinted spectacles
     
    NelliePledge, Nov 27, 2018
    #4
    Arnie Pye, Hutan, rvallee and 4 others like this.
  5. Hutan

    Hutan Moderator Staff Member

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    For those who missed this thread
    https://www.s4me.info/threads/bake-off-kim-joy-experience-of-working-in-nhs-mental-health.6918/

    The wisdom of Kim Joy, of the British Bake-off competition, seems worth repeating here in relation to the idea that 'more than 50%' of people who finished IAPT recover:

    Yes.
    30% of people referred to IAPT never begin treatment.

    Of the 70% of people who do start, it seems that 42% only do one session. So that's essentially another 30% of people doing only one session and then dropping out. Together, that's 60% of people referred who don't start or do just one session.

    So, we have a maximum of 40% of people referred for treatment finishing the treatment, but the drop out rate after the second session onwards is probably pretty significant too. The percentage of people referred actually finishing therapy could very easily be only around 20%.

    And then, of that small minority who actually finish the treatment, Kim-Joy tells us that 'a lot of people' are just making up their answers to questions about recovery.

    It's hardly impressive.
     
    Hutan, Nov 27, 2018
    #5
    Chezboo, ladycatlover, inox and 16 others like this.
  6. ladycatlover

    ladycatlover Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Sounds rather like the PACE trial doesn't it? :rofl:
     
    ladycatlover, Nov 27, 2018
    #6
    Sean, MEMarge, DokaGirl and 5 others like this.
  7. Sly Saint

    Sly Saint Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Meanwhile back in the 'real world'
    "'Mental health crisis is placing extra pressure on the police'
    A SENIOR Cumbrian police officer has welcomed a report which recognises how overstretched the police service is by the mental health crisis in the UK."
    https://www.nwemail.co.uk/news/1725...isis-is-placing-extra-pressure-on-the-police/

    https://twitter.com/user/status/1067330387343548416


    full report here:
    https://www.justiceinspectorates.go...g-and-mental-health-picking-up-the-pieces.pdf

    https://twitter.com/user/status/1067377306468057088
     
    Sly Saint, Nov 28, 2018
    #7
    MEMarge, ladycatlover, Hutan and 3 others like this.
  8. Suffolkres

    Suffolkres Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    NICE technical for ME should rule this out on lack of cost effectiveness then.
     
    Suffolkres, Nov 28, 2018
    #8
    MEMarge, ladycatlover, Invisible Woman and 1 other person like this.
  9. DokaGirl

    DokaGirl Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Some reasons people might overstate feeling less depressed, anxious etc., after counseling: they want to be done with the treatment, want to move on, their counselor might be a twit, they have found the treatment completely useless, aggravating, upsetting, harmful, their employer, family members, wanted them to get counseling, it's a condition of qualifying for disability assistance, they want to please the therapist, avoid conflict, etc.
     
    DokaGirl, Nov 28, 2018
    #9
    Sean, MEMarge, Snowdrop and 4 others like this.
  10. TiredSam

    TiredSam Committee Member

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    Fake maths.
     
    TiredSam, Dec 1, 2018
    #10
    MEMarge, Trish, ladycatlover and 1 other person like this.
  11. DokaGirl

    DokaGirl Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Exactly!
     
    DokaGirl, Dec 1, 2018
    #11
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  12. chrisb

    chrisb Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I'm not sure you're allowed to say that. It must be regarded as political. By extension that would make "New Labour" "Fake Labour", which would obviously be a dreadful calumny.
     
    chrisb, Dec 1, 2018
    #12
    TiredSam, ladycatlover and Invisible Woman like this.

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