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USA: NIH National Institutes of Health news

Discussion in 'News from organisations' started by Andy, Jan 16, 2018.

  1. Snow Leopard

    Snow Leopard Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    3,827
    Location:
    Australia
    Bullshit.

    They can review the quality of the reviews process. They can review why they are selecting terrible reviewers.

    The process is known to be flawed and there is much discussion on this.

    https://www.rand.org/pubs/technical_reports/TR742.html
    http://www.bmj.com/content/343/bmj.d4797
    http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0130450
    http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0002761
    http://psycnet.apa.org/doiLanding?doi=10.1037/0003-066X.63.3.160

    More, if I was to spend more than 5 minutes finding studies.
     
    Inara, ScottTriGuy, Valentijn and 3 others like this.
  2. petrichor

    petrichor Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    320
    Even if it's actually within their control to influence the outcome of grant applications by the way that they select grant reviewers, the best way to fix that is still through congress. Public servants don't actually care too much what the public think, because it isn't their job to care about that. Their job is just to follow the legislation that dictates their organisation, and do what politicians want them to do. (This is especially the case in the US, where governmental agencies have less independence than average from the will of politicians)

    Everyone in congress would be quite happy that the NIH is taking all the blame, because it means they don't have to take any responsibility. I think, though, it's all their responsibility. The NIH *kind of* has some excuses, but it's pretty justified to describe the response of everyone in congress as one of gross neglect.
     
    Inara likes this.
  3. Valentijn

    Valentijn Guest

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    2,275
    Location:
    Netherlands
    I rather doubt that Congress has the power or inclination to identify the biased reviewers and remove them from being used to review proposals. While funding is always an issue, there have been huge problems with high-quality proposals being rejected solely due to blatant bias regarding the etiology or classification of ME/CFS.

    More funding and more proposals are pointless if bad reviewers are still allowed to turn down projects which do not embrace the reviewers' baseless beliefs.
     
    Inara, Webdog, ScottTriGuy and 4 others like this.
  4. petrichor

    petrichor Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    320
    I was more referring to solving the problem by earmarking more funding in general, which, if it was a significant amount, would attract a lot more grant applications* and mean that much more grants are given. This has been done with many other conditions by congress, and it's already been done in Norway, where it worked extremely well. It might still mean that high quality applications are rejected, but at least others would get accepted. If they did something like a specific call for proposals which were all evaluated by a particular committee, that could also eliminate problems with some reviewers (I think that's what was done in Norway).

    Congress could also specifically earmark funding for biomedical research, if you're concerned about psychological research being funded. There are lots of options, and many of them are possible. As far as problems that politicians face go, this is an extremely easy one to solve.
     
    Last edited: Jan 20, 2018
    Inara, ScottTriGuy, Skycloud and 2 others like this.
  5. Andy

    Andy Committee Member

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    NIH's Francis Collins will be taking part in an Ask Me Anything event on Reddit, Fri 20th April

    https://twitter.com/user/status/986635999794159617


    https://www.genome.gov/20519689/celebrate-dna-day-with-nhgri/
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 19, 2022
    Samuel, Aroa, janice and 13 others like this.
  6. Esther12

    Esther12 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    4,393
    Is it worth signing up and asking things? Any idea what? I don't see an easy way of getting the NIH to comment on the problems with PACE, and that's all I really know about. Any suggestions?
     
  7. Andy

    Andy Committee Member

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    Location:
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    #MEAction suggest some ways of framing questions to Collins here
    https://www.meaction.net/2018/04/18...ncis-collins-anything-this-friday-at-2pm-est/
     
    Samuel, Keela Too, Skycloud and 7 others like this.
  8. Andy

    Andy Committee Member

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    21,956
    Location:
    Hampshire, UK
    Chris, Aroa and Esther12 like this.
  9. BurnA

    BurnA Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    410
    I'd forget all about PACE, the goal is more research money.


    Just ask him why he doesn't fund ME research commensurate with the burden of the disease.
     
    Samuel, mango, MarcNotMark and 11 others like this.
  10. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    7,208
    Location:
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    I am inclined to agree that it is not the best opportunity for PACE critiques, and he is not the best person to be pursuing about them.

    Ask about the money, and where it is going.
     
    Samuel, mango, BurnA and 2 others like this.
  11. Alvin

    Alvin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    3,309
    His answer will probably be that they don't have the resources and his hands are tied and he is doing everything he can in the current climate (and then will explain what we already know or throw in a tidbit)
    So whats a good reply to such an answer?
     
  12. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
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    Location:
    Australia
    Don't care. Don't want to hear any more excuses. Find more money for us.

    Tell every other NIH centre and department and unit that they are going to have to shave a quarter of a percent off their budget to fund our waaaaaaaaaaay overdue needs.

    Sorry, but I really don't care about other diseases any more. Not until we get our fair share. Nothing more, but nothing less. When that is achieved, then I will get all generous and caring again for other diseases.

    It is beyond outrageous and cruel that we have to keep begging for even token research funds. 6 million a year? You are going to have to add some zeros to that figure, and real soon.

    ME/CFS is a special case. It has been so ignored and so underfunded for so long that it needs special attention to even start catching up.

    I am in my mid 50s, and have been sick since I was 20. I am running out of time, and have run out of tolerance for any more excuses from the medical establishment.

    If the director of the NIH can't change the funding situation for us, then who can?

    :grumpy: :grumpy: :grumpy:
     
    TiredSam, Aroa, Ron and 12 others like this.
  13. Sunshine3

    Sunshine3 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Processes can be changed. Fact. Lost lives can't be returned.
     
    adambeyoncelowe and janice like this.
  14. Alvin

    Alvin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Your not going to get any argument from me since i completely agree with you but you don't go crazy on someone who holds the purse strings and expect him to help you.
    The reason i mentioned it was so we could have an answer for this likely response, and you get more flies with honey then vinegar. (usually).
    That doesn't mean be doormat but it does mean asking strategically and making a case that gets us the money.
    Can he unilaterally cut money from other diseases (if not then asking him to is a waste of this opportunity), does he have discretionary money available, can he make deals with commercial enterprises to get money on our behalf, are there other options that i have not mentioned?
     
  15. Alvin

    Alvin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    3,309
    My point is be ready for this answer and have a thought out answer ready. What options does he have that we can press for use to our benefit? If you want to win a battle it helps to understand how your adversary works and what his options are.
    When you anticipate what unhelpful answers your going to get you can have responses ready to move beyond them
     
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2018
    ScottTriGuy, Skycloud and Sunshine3 like this.
  16. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    7,208
    Location:
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    Sorry, @Alvin. Wasn't mad at you.

    Just getting very frustrated that nearly 3 years after the IOM report we are still being fobbed off with peanuts, and some of even that small change is still being spent of fucking psychobabble 'research'.

    Not interested in excuses any more. Where is the hard cash?
     
    Samuel, mango, MEMarge and 1 other person like this.
  17. Alvin

    Alvin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    3,309
    I understand, tell him off if you wish, will that get us money?

    Are the dollar amounts to each disease decided by congress and unchangeable, can he get back the money that was allocated but not spent for two(?) decades for ME/CFS, does he have a discretionary account to draw on, can he lobby and successfully get more money?
     
    Samuel, Sean, ScottTriGuy and 2 others like this.
  18. Sunshine3

    Sunshine3 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Alvin, I hope you will be on reddit so you can ask those questions..
     
    MEMarge and Alvin like this.
  19. Alvin

    Alvin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I will not unfortunately, and i don't have the knowledge of the NIH money constraints or procedures, though i hope someone reading this does and can ask excellent questions

    Are you able to attend and ask the questions i have posted?
     
  20. Sunshine3

    Sunshine3 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    622
    I am trying to get in at.present
     
    Aroa, Andy, Nellie and 3 others like this.

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