COVID-19 vaccine: UK regulators warn people with history of 'significant' allergic reactions not to have Pfizer/BioNTech jab

Apparently, the moderna vaccine creates even more side effects



I can't help thinking any vaccine that causes fever is probably a bad idea for severely affected ME patients, esp given that there's a second dose. Patients who take more than a few days to recover from minor setbacks seem likely to find this really hard going.
 
youngscum said:
I can't help thinking any vaccine that causes fever is probably a bad idea for severely affected ME patients, esp given that there's a second dose. Patients who take more than a few days to recover from minor setbacks seem likely to find this really hard going.
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Given that Covid-19 itself causes all these symptoms and has quite a high rate of making people of my age (over 70) so sick they are hospitalised and of killing people, as well as a high rate at all ages of causing long Covid and likely ME, I still think it preferable, for me, to have the vaccine. Of course it should be up to individuals with ME to do their own analysis of the risks they are prepared to take with or without a vaccine.
 
youngscum said:
Apparently, the moderna vaccine creates even more side effects
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The high level of acute side effects compared to traditional vaccines has been discussed by @Hilda Bastian on her blog for months now.

https://hildabastian.net/

The key point that many observers (and the media) seem to miss is that this high level of side effect is in part a consequence of the high dosages used.
Much higher doses (in terms of immunogenic units per volume) are needed for DNA/RNA/Viral vector vaccines than subunit vaccines, inactivated viral vaccines.

I suspect this is one of the reasons why such vaccines have not become mainstream, despite the technology having existed in a feasible form for around 10 years.

Long term, SARS-CoV-2 may still be controlled by more "traditional" subunit or inactivated viral vaccines, especially when considering the storage/transport requirements of the mRNA vaccines.
 
Trish said:
Given that Covid-19 itself causes all these symptoms and has quite a high rate of making people of my age (over 70) so sick they are hospitalised and of killing people, as well as a high rate at all ages of causing long Covid and likely ME, I still think it preferable, for me, to have the vaccine. Of course it should be up to individuals with ME to do their own analysis of the risks they are prepared to take with or without a vaccine.
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I agree, and I still hope to have the Oxford vaccine if it doesn't sound so bad. But I do wish there were some idea of what ME patients are likely to have to deal with in all this. I can remember a time when it would have taken me 6 weeks to recover from a car journey. As such, doing something twice that make a lot of healthy people feel very unwell leaves me feeling pretty uncomfortable.

I guess that, having a lame doctor again after a long time of having better ones, I feel the helplessness of being told 'this is fine' by people who haven't engaged with the problem and who will wash their hands of any trouble later on.
 
youngscum said:
I agree, and I still hope to have the Oxford vaccine if it doesn't sound so bad.
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Just a note, the 'Oxford' vaccine has a similar rate of acute side effects (fevers etc) to the mRNA vaccines.

I wouldn't bet on the 'Oxford' vaccine being approved at all, given the inferior efficacy and sloppy handling of trial data.

Additional reading.
"A timeline of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine trials"
http://hildabastian.net/index.php/100
 
Snow Leopard said:
Just a note, the 'Oxford' vaccine has a similar rate of acute side effects (fevers etc) to the mRNA vaccines.

I wouldn't bet on the 'Oxford' vaccine being approved at all, given the inferior efficacy and sloppy handling of trial data.

Additional reading.
"A timeline of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine trials"
http://hildabastian.net/index.php/100
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Well, that's looking up then : )
 
youngscum said:
Well, that's looking up then : )
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There are still plenty of horses left in the race. But I know not every country has the luxury of waiting.

(the Australian government states that they aren't going to approve a vaccine until March - which might sound alarming, until you hear that we currently have just one active locally transmitted case, a worker at a quarantine hotel)
 
Personally I think there might be an advantage here in the UK of ME not being included in the highest risk category in relation to Covid-19. Certainly for myself it is looking like I am not likely to be offered any vaccine before at least March. Though this means I will need to self isolate till then, it does give time for more information on the potential impacts of the vaccine(s) to come to light. Certainly at present any attempt at balancing personal risks is largely guess work.
 
It's not scientific, but my daughter, who has coeliac disease, asthma and a latex allergy, had the vaccine last Thursday. She is fine except for the usual feeling of a bruise at the site of the injection.

Most of the frontline staff at the hospital have now been vaccinated and she has not heard of anyone having a problem. In fact she will be working 2 extra 12 hour nightshifts this week as staff have been told to take most of their annual leave before Christmas so the wards are short staffed just now.:)
 
youngscum said:
Apparently, the moderna vaccine creates even more side effects



I can't help thinking any vaccine that causes fever is probably a bad idea for severely affected ME patients, esp given that there's a second dose. Patients who take more than a few days to recover from minor setbacks seem likely to find this really hard going.
Click to expand...

This is unfortunate but also extremely interesting in understanding how those symptoms arise and their mechanism of action. Especially given the similarity and overlap with Covid symptoms.

That is, if someone is doing the research and not just leaving this important information on the table. As usually happens. Which is terrible because it could tell us many things about how those symptoms function and cause dysfunction, not from an external agent causing trouble but merely by the immune system doing its thing.
 
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