The Concept of ME/CFS, 2024, Edwards

I am aware that the lying flat bit and the unpredictability are not 'in the books' but to me they point to aspects that have not been that well covered by the standard accounts and so I think they are worth stressing a bit.

I have now listened to about 500 people on forums describing their symptoms. I am pretty sure that not having an element of feeling forced to lie flat and not having an element of unpredictability are atypical. That isn't to say not having them must be outside the syndrome but time and time again I hear people talking about OI in the wider sense that being recumbent or partly recumbent is necessary some of the time. And I think this distinguishes ME/CFS symptoms quite clearly from 'secondary fatigue' seen with systemic illness like renal failure or RA. I also think it is not typical of depression. I have trained on, and visited, wards with people with severe depressive illness and encountered it in the family. In general the seriously depressed individual sits motionless looking out of a window or into the middle of a room. It also emphasises that the problem is not just deconditioning or lack of ability to move about, although that lack is there. It is a symptom complex that no way would one expect to benefit from doing exercises any more than you would tell someone with acute vertigo to go for a walk (ensuring that they vomit and call over).

But thanks for the comments.

I discovered 20 + years ago that by lying completely flat/ head level with heart for 10 minutes that this would enable me to be vertical , sat down for next 4-6 hrs. However I was always cautious about being flat for too long……I didn’t want to cause more damage than benefit by under use . I simply found it a very useful as an energy top up means. Then having used remedial yoga a lot/ basically horizontal yoga, then I discovered Restorative Yoga by Judith Lassiter. This introduced me to the benefits of getting my head below my heart for short periods of time.
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...then I discovered Restorative Yoga by Judith Lassiter. This introduced me to the benefits of getting my head below my heart for short periods of time.


Peter Rowe in his new book about orthostatic intolerance says, 'Another time-honored recommendation is to elevate the head of the bed slightly by 10-15 degrees so that the head is higher than the feet [ref: MacLean and Alen, 'Orthostatic hypotension and orthostatic tachycardia'; Ten Harkel, vnlieshout, and Wieling, 'Treatment of orthostatic hypotension.']...This position helps the body retain blood volume at night. Some patients with severe ME/CFS can experience worse blood flow in this position, so it may not be tolerated by all.'

So flat or a bit tilted up or down!
 
Likewise, more criticism could have been made explicitly of the group of professionals who for so long have promoted a view that ME/CFS is not a “real” illness, but is simply due to a combination of faulty illness beliefs and deconditioning. The harm that these views have done and continue to do to the patient community is immense and one of the major medical scandals of the last 50-60 years.
This is fair and deserves its time in the spotlight, but it's important to take into account that for all their terrible, dishonorable, behavior and lies, pretty much any random group of MDs would have likely concluded the same. This isn't a failure of small group of people. It's a whole profession failure distributed across thousands of systems and institutions, all of which failed just as hard.

This is what we are seeing with Long Covid. Maybe it's a consequence of their work, but I doubt it. Most researchers and clinicians approaching this do not have in mind any of this history, most have never heard of ME/CFS. They are looking at the phenomenon, apply their medical training, and basically conclude the same things all on their own. After all, those conclusions literally require no skills, no training, no evidence of any kind. It's a simple popular logical fallacy, the most common error in medicine: if I don't know of it, it can't exist, all tests are normal.

So for sure they have done disastrous harm, but it was mostly through their very effective campaigns of vilification than their mediocre research. I don't think it would have mattered much either way in the end. Medicine has long been primed to swallow this nonsense and there isn't much that could have pulled things to any other outcome.

Not that it absolves them of any blame, but it's ultimately mostly irrelevant. The vast majority of clinicians and therapists who first saw LC patients, have been working with those, some for years now, having seen hundreds or even thousands, all failed the same way, for the same reasons. They can't see that what they're doing is useless, that there is no credible evidence for what they are doing, and if it hadn't been exercise rehabilitation with CBT, it probably have been some other set of useless rituals.

The greatest tragedy here is perhaps that they have been cruel jerks for no reason at all. They could have achieved the exact same outcomes without it. They did this because we pushed back. Perhaps the other lesson to take from this. How medicine is essentially incapable of self-correcting. We sure are seeing it happen in broad daylight and on a bigger stage than ever.
 
This isn't a failure of small group of people.

I agree. I don't even think it is a failure of the medical profession. It is a reflection of human beings' inability to understand how little they know of other people's experiences and how ready they are to jump to conclusions about cause and effect. The BPS view is popular prejudice given fancy names.

But also, there is an important sense in which Nigel has missed the historical point I was making.
My colleague asked me what justified a separate concept of ME. His question was asked on the basis of having learnt, like myself, that 'ME', as originally defined, had turned out not to be a real disease but a misplaced speculation. There never was an encephalitis, or even an encephalopathy, nor yet a 'complex multi system disease'. And those words in the NICE guideline show that part of that confusion is still very much there, particularly amongst charities and advocacy groups. We still have people researching 'neuroinflammation' when there was never a reason to think any was there.

Nigel mentions the harm done by the BPS approach but my article is deliberately not about one group of doctors sniping at another. More than anything we want that to stop. And who knows what harm may have come from perpetuating the myth of 'ME' as a mysterious encephalitic disease. The reality is that everyone has failed to solve the problem or even get near to understanding it, physicians, psychiatrists and public alike. Blaming each other doesn't seem to me the way forward.
 
There never was an encephalitis, or even an encephalopathy, nor yet a 'complex multi system disease'. And those words in the NICE guideline show that part of that confusion is still very much there, particularly amongst charities and advocacy groups.

The language issue really needs tackling by charities and advocates.

Descriptive phrases like 'complex multi-system disease' are important because we need to talk how ME/CFS affects people—sometimes in shorthand—but they do need challenging for accuracy and effectiveness. This phrase is about multi-system symptoms, not disease, and the word complex isn't needed as it's already implied. Multi-system itself isn't especially effective, because it doesn't communicate much about ME/CFS; most long term illnesses seem to affect more than one system.
 
There is another comment on Jonathan's Qeios article, by a professor of sleep medicine.

https://www.qeios.com/read/WMQGBY
https://www.qeios.com/read/WMQGBY

Oh dear:

Markku Partinen said:
The term ME may act as a nocebo. [...] Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. The term "chronic" is also misleading. Chronic means "...lasting forever". A chronic disease cannot be cured. However, people woth ME/CFS may get much better by rehabilitation. They ,may be able to return to work or to go back to school ME/CFS is not "chonic", but it is, unfortunately, often a longstanding illness.
 
"Oh dear" is understating things. Just looking at the overall slapdash formulation: no attention to precision or formatting. This appears intended to be a review of Jo's paper, but has been posted as a comment on Nigel Speight's review. This is supposedly a professor. Well, as has been said before, there are professors and there are professors.

unfortunately the review does not give better alternatives to be used as a general name for this illness

It's literally in the title: "ME/CFS".

ME stands for myalgic encephalomyelities. However, in most patients there has been no evidence for and infection/ inflammation of the spinal cord or of the brains.

"SLE stands for systemic lupus erythematosus. However, in most patients there has been no evidence for wolves."

Cerebrospinal fluid samples are usually normal.

Even the NIH found "In cerebrospinal fluid, the PI-ME/CFS group had statistically significant decreased levels of DOPA, DOPAC, and DHPG"

The term ME may act as a nocebo.

How might the word "me" act as a nocebo? Or do you mean "myalgic encephalomyelities [sic]"?

The term "chronic" is also misleading. Chronic means "...lasting forever".

Chronic means long-term, of long duration. It does not mean forever.

A chronic disease cannot be cured.

That would be news to those who have cured TB, HIV, Hep C, RA, cystic fibrosis etc. And I guess my oncology colleagues can just give up completely curing children with stage 4 cancers.

However, people woth ME/CFS may get much better by rehabilitation. They ,may be able to return to work or to go back to school ME/CFS is not "chonic", but it is, unfortunately, often a longstanding illness.

The evidence disagrees with you.
 
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