Finland: 2023 Helsinki University Long Covid conference

Hutan · Mar 25, 2023

Trish said: ↑

That's assuming he watched the rest of their presentations. He did his remotely, so may not have watched the rest.
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There is mention of him having to respond to leading questions though:

The presentation was followed by a short discussion part, where the organizers asked questions trying to get Nath to state that anxiety, worry, avoidance behavior or other psychosocial factors were the cause or at least the maintaining factor of the patients’ symptoms. However, Nath noted, that many diseases like epilepsy were also considered hysteria and psychosomatic before medical science understood their biological mechanisms. In this context, he stated that the mistakes of the past should not be repeated.
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So, I'm sure the event reinforced the closed mindedness of BPS advocates to Nath. Perhaps it will be the most important outcome of this conference, which otherwise was just BPS proponents preaching to each other.

Sean · Mar 26, 2023

One possible good out of this conference is that it might indicate how the BPS club is becoming more insular and isolated from mainstream medicine, and irrelevant.

Having them corralled off to the side like that would help make them readily identifiable to the rest of the world so it can keep a more effective eye on them and what they are trying to do.

rvallee · Mar 26, 2023

Sean said: ↑

One possible good out of this conference is that it might indicate how the BPS club is becoming more insular and isolated from mainstream medicine, and irrelevant.

Having them corralled off to the side like that would help make them readily identifiable to the rest of the world so it can keep a more effective eye on them and what they are trying to do.
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The mistake here is thinking that the BPS model is separate from mainstream medicine. It isn't. It is the model of mainstream medicine. It has two modes: scientific and biopsychosocial.

One mode works and is applied a lot where people care about outcomes. The other is the default alternative. But it's not separate. Everything coming out of medicine tells me that most think it's the future of medicine, and it would be even worse today if it wasn't for constant opposition from patients.

It's a harsh truth but it's important to not forget it. THIS is modern medicine. This is why it's so hard to beat this zombie ideology, we are literally fighting the model on which modern healthcare is built. Even if it's the part that doesn't work, it's the only game in town for now, and is more dominant than at any point in history.

It's not like talking in secret, and in codes, and having secret conferences is anything new. It is the only way this has ever happened. In darkness, and with loads of BS to fertilize it.

Wyva · Mar 29, 2023

This was posted today on the FB page of the Finnish ME/CFS association:

Facebook translation:

'MPs are requesting an investigation into the long covid symposium organized by Hus: 'Potentially causing widespread harm and endangering patient safety'

According to MPs, it is irresponsible to organize a training for a wide public of doctors, which gives visibility to belief-based treatments. '

28.3. from media news The published article talks about the letter sent by MPs belonging to the ME/CFS network to Husi, expressing their concern that Husin is 16.3. The lecturers of the treatment and rehabilitation section of the seminar on prolonged corona disease or long covid organized by professionals and the opener of the meeting (Markku Sainio) exclusively represented the school board of functional disorders.

"This does not represent international treatment recommendations nor scientific consensus and endangers the treatment and rehabilitation of patients in Finland. We will take care that the seminar will spread among doctors action models that are not based on scientific consensus, that expose vulnerable patients to mistreatment and deny them treatment", the MPs say. '

The full article behind the paywall can be found here: https://www.mediuutiset.fi/uutiset/...arantava/13b53c1a-44ed-44f2-9fc3-235e6de71be6
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belbyr · Mar 29, 2023

This isn’t the first time I’ve heard Nath mention macrophages. It sounds like he took a stand for us too!

NelliePledge · Mar 29, 2023

Good. Perhaps the conference organisers have actually done the ME community in Finland a favour by showing journalists and politicians what the community faces.

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Finland: 2023 Helsinki University Long Covid conference

Hutan Moderator Staff Member

Sean Moderator Staff Member

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Finland: 2023 Helsinki University Long Covid conference

Hutan Moderator Staff Member

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belbyr Established Member (Voting Rights)

NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

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