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Australia: Say NO to the cashless debit card!

Discussion in 'Advocacy Action Alerts' started by Simone, Feb 11, 2020.

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  1. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Nope.
     
    alex3619, Feb 11, 2020
    #21
  2. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I will have to give my card to a third party, then the PIN, totally violating security. There is currently no way around this. Over time, and multiple support workers, many people will wind up with my PIN, so I will have to keep changing it ... and I already cannot remember passwords and PINs.
     
    alex3619, Feb 11, 2020
    #22
    FMMM1, Andy, JaneL and 3 others like this.
  3. Simone

    Simone Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Location:
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    The issue about carers having to have the card to buy stuff for people is a huge one. They’ve not considered housebound or bedbound people at all.
     
    Simone, Feb 11, 2020
    #23
    rvallee, Andy, JaneL and 5 others like this.
  4. Simone

    Simone Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Location:
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    That’s terrible! How does the agent make people pay their rent?
     
    Simone, Feb 11, 2020
    #24
    FMMM1, Andy, JaneL and 2 others like this.
  5. large donner

    large donner Guest

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    large donner, Feb 12, 2020
    #25
    Simone and alktipping like this.
  6. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

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    Location:
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    People on social security are just the test group for introducing a fully cashless society, which is one of the critical infrastructure elements of an authoritarian state. (The others being knowing your location at all times, who you are communicating with, and your medical records.)

    The rest of Oz society just have not twigged yet what a fully cashless society really means. So they are happy to let it be done to us undeserving feckless bludgers on welfare, in the delusion that they are safe from it being done to them.

    When they realise what they have done to themselves, they better not look to me for sympathy, because all I will have is bitter mocking laughter at their idiocy.
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2020
    Sean, Feb 12, 2020
    #26
    Invisible Woman, Andy, JaneL and 2 others like this.
  7. Simone

    Simone Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Location:
    Australia
    To be fair, not all online stores are banned, but there are restrictions, and some huge sites are banned (eg: eBay and PayPal), but others (like iHerb) are not.

    There are so many stories about people having issues with the card, but the government is just glossing over them all. They‘re determined to make this happen.
     
    Simone, Feb 12, 2020
    #27
    rvallee, Invisible Woman, Andy and 2 others like this.
  8. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

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    Location:
    Australia
    Which just happen to be my two main online purchase sites.

    The ability to buy online is one of my main financial and health management tools. It saves both money and time/energy, and on more than a few occasions has made something possible that could not be done any other way (e.g. sourcing out of production spare parts to fix something that otherwise has plenty of life left in it, and thus saving considerable money).

    This is going to be a disaster, and it is entirely intentional on the part of the government. They are doing everything they can to make social security as traumatic and dysfunctional as possible, to drive people off it, and as a warning to those not on it about what will happen to them if they even try to apply for it.

    It is conspicuous cruelty.

    Also, what happens to joint accounts, where one person is not on benefits? How does that work?

    And what about existing cash in accounts? Does that get put onto the card? I am planning to withdraw all my modest funds just before it is introduced. Might buy (ha ha) enough breathing space until the next election, and potentially a new government (which is no guarantee anything will change, of course, but at least it is a possibility).
     
    Sean, Feb 12, 2020
    #28
    Invisible Woman, chrisb, Andy and 4 others like this.
  9. Simone

    Simone Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    The complacency of so many around so many topics: increased surveillance, meta-data etc. It’s mind-numbing.
     
    Simone, Feb 12, 2020
    #29
    Invisible Woman, chrisb, Andy and 4 others like this.
  10. Simone

    Simone Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Location:
    Australia
    This card is separate to existing accounts, so won’t affect joint accounts and won’t affect cash in your accounts, because Indue and the card can’t access your bank account. It’s like getting a brand new debit card account in your name only and at a separate bank (which isn’t a bank and doesn’t offer the fraud protections of a bank), but with loads of restrictions of where you can use the money that’s put into the account.

    It also means that any direct debits you’ve got set up would need to be changed so that they come out of the new card account, not your current bank account or credit card (unless you can cover them under the 20%). This alone is a huge deal for MEeps.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 12, 2020
    Simone, Feb 12, 2020
    #30
    Invisible Woman, Andy, JaneL and 3 others like this.
  11. Snow Leopard

    Snow Leopard Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    3,860
    Location:
    Australia
    https://www.dss.gov.au/families-and...e-conditionality/cashless-debit-card-overview

    Also:

    https://www.dss.gov.au/sites/defaul...tsheet-common-misconceptions-extra-text_0.pdf

    Which is still outrageously expensive!
     
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2020
    Snow Leopard, Feb 12, 2020
    #31
    FMMM1, Invisible Woman, Andy and 3 others like this.
  12. alex3619

    alex3619 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    They have a range of options, but only one works for me as a mostly housebound person.
     
    alex3619, Feb 12, 2020
    #32
    Invisible Woman, Andy and Simone like this.
  13. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

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    Believe it when I see that process actually working fairly and promptly. Not holding my breath. It would be completely contrary to everything this government has done to the social security system and every attitude they hold to its users.

    https://www.sbs.com.au/nitv/article...s-can-soon-apply-opt-out-cashless-card-trials

    https://www.theguardian.com/austral...e-card-trial-is-almost-impossible-critics-say
     
    Sean, Feb 12, 2020
    #33
    Invisible Woman, Andy, Simone and 1 other person like this.
  14. Simone

    Simone Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    It’s so disgusting.

    People who are poor struggle to pay bills because they, by definition, don’t have enough money. That lack of money is then used as evidence that they’re incapable of managing their finances (rather than reflecting the reality that social security payments haven’t kept up with the cost of living), and then used to refuse them exiting the card.

    My understanding is that there’s no evidence that anyone who has applied to exit the program has been allowed to do so.
     
    Simone, Feb 12, 2020
    #34
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  15. Simone

    Simone Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Location:
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    Simone, Feb 12, 2020
    #35
    Invisible Woman, mango, Sean and 2 others like this.
  16. chrisb

    chrisb Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    You know how it is with politicians. They try to solve one problem by creation of a worse one. They probably won't be around to sort out the mess. Indeed, careers have been created on that premise.
     
    chrisb, Feb 12, 2020
    #36
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  17. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

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    What is really disgusting is that they get away with it. They not only face no punishment for it, but are even rewarded for it with re-election.
     
    Sean, Feb 12, 2020
    #37
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  18. Simone

    Simone Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Location:
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    Yep. No matter what they do.
     
    Simone, Feb 12, 2020
    #38
    Sean likes this.
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