Lightning Process - discussion thread

Yea.. Accuracy doesn't really seem to be his thing.

 

Nina E. Steinkopf with interesting news from Norway.

The Norwegian Directorate of Health and the Consumer Ombudsman defined LP coaches as practitioners of alternative treatment in 2018.

This year, LP coaches asked the Norwegian Directorate of Health to review that definition. The Directorate complied and stated that LP is not a form of alternative treatment.

However, in a letter to the LP association this autumn the Directorate has again changed their mind and pulls their statement. In short they say it's not their mandate to define what is and what is not alternative treatment.

It seems that in order to assess whether or not LP is to be defined as alternative treatment, someone must submit a report to the police or a complaint to the Consumer Authority.

The Norwegian Consumer Ombudsman and Norway's National Research Center in Complementary and Alternativ Medicine however, both define LP as alternative treatment.

Confused? Me too...

Nina E. Steinkopf: Helsedirektoratet trekker tilbake uttalelse om Lightning Process
google translation: The Norwegian Directorate of Health withdraws statement of Lightning Process

 

If not alternative treatment, what would it be? Quackery? Surely not mainstream medical treatment.

 

good question. This is a google translation of the argumentation from the LP association from Nina E. Steinkopf's article:

The decision was based on the LP association's view on the matter: “LP must be regarded as a teaching activity where stress-regulating and performance-enhancing knowledge and techniques are disseminated, which by use can increase the participants' stress management competence and mental resilience. The association shows that the purpose of the teaching is not to alleviate or treat illness, and that such an intention cannot be deduced from the marketing of the course offer on its own website and in the dialogue with the course participants. In the association's view, the LP instructors' activities cannot be assessed on the basis of the marketing of LP in the United Kingdom and Phil Parker's mention of the method as this is not representative of the Norwegian LP activities. ».

 

Isn't "Lightning Process" a registered trademark? Would PP have a right of action for admitted breach of trademark if it is?

 

Alternatively would anyone failing to improve have an action for fraudulent misrepresentation if the procedure being offered is not that of the original LP?

EDIT and/or breach of contract.

 

What Industry a company is registered as is public info in Norway. Here the most profiled LP coach. Attached Google translate of the central parts.

(Bonus info: education/training could be exempt VAT in Norway. Alternative treatments is 25% VAT.)

 

This seems to be becoming a feature of the Lightening Process, if we are seeing a breakaway coach in Norway, as well as in New Zealand.

 

Another article from Nina E. Steinkopf who tells the story of a parent of a child who underwent LP. The article was first published in July 2021, but has now been translated into English.

Treating children with the Lightning Process

quote:
It was a scary experience for me as a parent. How bad was it then, for him who had to go through this?

We have made many mistakes as parents – because we wanted to help. Sending him on a LP course is one of the biggest mistakes and has given me a lot of guilt. I consider exposing my child to LP as a form of abuse, sadly.

 

https://twitter.com/user/status/1457175761048178689

https://twitter.com/user/status/1457249089586929664


From Wikipedia page on Simon Singh:

(I’ve also posted these tweets on the NICE guideline stakeholder submissions thread: https://www.s4me.info/threads/nice-...1-discussion-thread.23066/page-12#post-389420)

 

I have heard rumours that there are several patient surveys of the results from the Lightning Process.

I have found a Norwegian Report that shows 50% of patients worsened (some severely). https://www.me-foreningen.no/wp-content/uploads/2016/09/ME-Nat-Norwegian-Survey-Abr-Eng-Ver.pdf

Are there any other patient studies /surveys to be aware of?

 

This academic book has 3 chapters written or cowritten by Phil Parker:

1st Edition
Neurolinguistic Programming in Clinical Settings
Theory and evidence- based practice
Edited By
Lisa de Rijk
Richard Gray
Frank Bourke
https://www.routledge.com/Neuroling...--based/Rijk-Gray-Bourke/p/book/9781032057200

 

Moved post

Not sure where else to post this, but a Reddit user posted about their experience with LP. Seems pretty typical and in line with others. Medicine making it clear they are still in the dark ages with chronic illness when so many authorities are pushing for this stuff, or are at least fine with it. Completely indefensible, this is brain worms stuff.

Toxic Positivity: My experience of the ‘lightning process’

 

Merged thread

Toxic Positivity: My experience of the ‘lightning process’

Edit : I've just realised that my post and its title implies that I wrote the reddit post. I want to make it clear that this is not my reddit post! I've never done LP and have no plans to either.

...

Posted on Reddit on 27th Jan 2022

Title : Toxic Positivity: My experience of the ‘lightning process’
Link :

Code:

 https://www.reddit.com/r/cfs/comments/sebew1/toxic_positivity_my_experience_of_the_lightning/

Post continues - and there are lots of replies - at :

Code:

https://www.reddit.com/r/cfs/comments/sebew1/toxic_positivity_my_experience_of_the_lightning/

 

M.E. Awareness NZ has recently published a position statement on alternative therapies, including The Lightning Process and the related The Switch.
Happy to receive any feedback.

https://m.e.awareness.nz/position-statements