News from The Netherlands

Discussion in 'Regional news' started by ME/CFS Skeptic, May 6, 2020.

  1. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Dolphin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  3. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    ME Research UK

    News from The Netherlands - the ME/CFS Cohort and Biobank consortium (NMCB) has begun and eventually 6 projects will focus on biomedical research into ME/CFS. One of these is The Netherlands Brain Bank for ME/CFS (NHB-ME/CFS) which aims to collect brain tissue and make samples available to researchers worldwide.

    Currently, 20 people with ME/CFS are already registered with The Netherlands Brain Bank and a call within The Netherlands has been made for more donors. https://tinyurl.com/y8h86bsj

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    The Netherlands ME/CFS Cohort and Biobank (NMCB) consortium
     
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  4. Hutan

    Hutan Moderator Staff Member

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  5. Dolphin

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  6. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Some organization that calls itself (translated) "Association against quackery" is criticizing what is essentially the biopsychosocial model exactly as applied to us, seemingly unaware that this borrows entirely from, well, medicine. They don't seem to have noticed.

    The therapists doing this all simply borrow straight from the BPS playbook. Don't even have to change anything. Medicine created the most potent pseudoscience by... creating their own. Ah well.

    BMR Methods Confused Bullshit
    https://www.kwakzalverij.nl/nieuws/bmr-methodes-warrige-lariekoek/

    Dozens of therapists claim to be able to tackle psychological complaints such as burnout and anxiety disorders with BMR (Body Mind Release or Body Mind Reset).

    The BMR methods could be used to treat psychiatric/medical disorders, the inventors claim without providing adequate evidence. And according to the BMR treatment list of both inventors, we are talking about psychological complaints, burnout, stress, behavioral problems, PTSD, eating disorders, depression, anxiety and anxiety disorder and trauma processing.

    These are unproven quackery claims in which untrained therapists move in often complicated medical/psychiatric terrain. Some psychiatrists consulted have not heard of either MMR method before, there are no serious studies into their effectiveness. The medical database PubMed does not know either MMR method or their inventors, which reduces the credibility to zero.
    ...
    Both BMR methods are very similar to Neuro Linguistic Programming (NLP) , the technique that tsjakka-patatman Emile Ratelband brought from the US to the Netherlands in the eighties. Willem Levelt, now emeritus professor of psycholinguistics, branded NLP 'nonsense' in the magazine Skepter twenty years ago . A label that should actually be stuck on both BMR variants.

    It is therefore all the more strange that the official government agency UWV uses BMR therapists in the context of reintegration processes. We have previously written on this website about the detested STAP scheme of UWV, which uncritically financed quackery. The only substantiation UWV has behind the application of BMR – the release variant – is an extremely high we-of-toilet-duck content study. We will come back to this later.​


    It is therefore not strange. Since this is all coming straight from psychiatry and neurology. It's official medicine, there is no longer any real difference between scientific medicine and alternative medicine, because everywhere science has not yet given answers, they created their own damn pseudoscience.

    I don't see them realize the scope of what they've done for many decades, the blind are leading the blind to where the blind have been looping around for decades. It's a well-worn path, but paved on with the bodies of millions.
     
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  7. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Like, are they aware that the chief medical scientist of their country, whatever her title is, is a huge fan of this stuff? Is heavily promoting it? I guess not.
     
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  8. Grigor

    Grigor Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  9. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    So it would be more fair to call them The Association against some quackery but for some other forms.

    I think the person I was thinking of is in Norway, the head of medical science that saying bad things about us. Ah well, they are so interchangeable.
     
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  10. Jaybee00

    Jaybee00 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  11. Hutan

    Hutan Moderator Staff Member

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  12. Dolphin

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  13. Hutan

    Hutan Moderator Staff Member

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    From the announcement above:
    Is this a good thing? Does anyone know what the care pathway includes? Possible even just the idea that they have treatments to offer, and the seeming lack of differentiation of various post-covid effects (e.g. 'patients with post-COVID') is a bad sign. Are there any people involved whose names we would recognise?
     
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  14. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  15. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Oddly arbitrary. Also at this point remission and recovery are rather rare so they will be especially useless. The trend over recent years and the data from LC has been that 3 months is more than enough. I guess this is one way of triaging people to reduce demand, but since the overall policy is constant mass reinfections even that won't be nearly enough. And anyway they don't know what to do because they can't be bothered to put effort into it.
    So are ME/CFS, IBS, fibromyalgia, dysautonomia and the rest of what is usually labeled for this type of illness unknown? Or is it "unknown" (winky face)? Also of course it falls under Long Covid, what is this nonsense?
    Oh, definitely previously unknown. Never heard of that before. Can't hear you with my whole arms up my ears lalalalala.
    Hey it's only getting close to 5 years and has been subject to deep controversy for decades, was predicted from the start and y'all are still completely oblivious to the scale of the problem. No need to hurry. Take all the time in the world like you always do here.
     
  16. SNT Gatchaman

    SNT Gatchaman Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Dutch News: 10,000 Long Covid patients on benefits, more may follow

    Costing €200 million a year (conservatively) and we're about to trial "anti-allergy medication, anti-depressants and beta blockers which may alleviate symptoms"
     
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  17. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

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    I hope the trying out medications means proper clinical trials, not just random prescribing.
     
  18. Turtle

    Turtle Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    My country has always been known to be on the penny.
    And now at the 200 million euro mark they "see" 10.000 long Covid sufferers?
    The patients or the costs?
    That's what I call (covid) dumbing down government.
    ME/CFS is still a "between the ears" thing here.
    I'm feeling for LC patients having to rely on those centers.
    Nothing to offer than; let's try "something"?
     
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  19. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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