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News from Scandinavia

Discussion in 'Regional news' started by Kalliope, Nov 2, 2017.

  1. mango

    mango Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,522
    BPS proponents David Gyll, Carl Sjöström and Henrik Vogt wrote a reply:

    Brett perspektiv ger precision vid postcovid
    https://lakartidningen.se/opinion/debatt/2022/10/brett-perspektiv-ger-precision-vid-postcovid/

    Google Translate, English ("Broad perspective provides precision in postcovid")
    Bergquist et al recently replied:

    Replik: Författarna har missförstått vår avsikt
    https://lakartidningen.se/opinion/debatt/2022/10/replik-forfattarna-har-missforstatt-var-avsikt/

    Google Translate, English ("Reply: The authors have misunderstood our intention")
     
  2. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    7,159
    Location:
    Australia
    In order to understand postinfectious syndromes and help individuals, more research is needed that takes a holistic approach to psychological, sociological, anthropological and biological perspectives [13].

    Now that is an arbitrary assumption.

    I broke my hand once. All I needed was a simple cast, and it did the job just fine, without any additional psychological, sociological, and anthropological perspectives.

    They are engaged in a blatant power grab over everything in medicine, regardless of robustly demonstrated relevance and need.
     
    Solstice, bobbler, rvallee and 4 others like this.
  3. mango

    mango Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,522
    One of the authors comments on Twitter:

    "We had a paragraph in our reply where we questioned that the journal of the Swedish Medical Association even publishes a reply that refers to an article from 1970 as support in the argumentation about postcovid. Unfortunately, it was deleted."
     
    RedFox, Kalliope and Trish like this.
  4. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    12,421
    Location:
    Canada
    They talk so much and say so little. Every argument they make is egocentric and just the same old recycled garbage. Everything about themselves, for themselves, by themselves. Mediocre.
     
  5. mango

    mango Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,522
    Trish likes this.
  6. mango

    mango Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,522
    Anna Amholt tvingas sluta – 22 år gammal
    https://www.aftonbladet.se/sportbla...sluta-karriaren-blir-inte-frisk-fran-covid-19

     
    rvallee, Kalliope and Art Vandelay like this.
  7. RedFox

    RedFox Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,245
    Location:
    Pennsylvania
    bobbler, BrightCandle and mango like this.
  8. Ravn

    Ravn Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,059
    Location:
    Aotearoa New Zealand
    Good article in the Danish newspaper Information.
    original Danish:
    https://www.information.dk/debat/20...nter-behandling-danmark-lytter-ingen?lst_tag=

    Google translated:
    https://www-information-dk.translat...=da&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en-US&_x_tr_pto=wapp
     
    RedFox, Sean, mango and 3 others like this.
  9. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    12,421
    Location:
    Canada
    This reckless attitude reminds me of this. When you can simply reject reality and substitute your own, nothing matters anymore.

    "Well if that were true it would be terrible. But it is not."

    And these people make a show out of pretending to listen to patients. Then they simply reply: you're lying, we know better.

    sharpe-is-condescending.jpg
     
    V.R.T., Ravn, bobbler and 1 other person like this.
  10. mango

    mango Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,522
    BPS article on a ME case study, written by a GP at the ME center in Linköping, Sweden. Published in AllmänMedicin (the journal of the Swedish GP organisation SFAM).

    Att stoppa snöbollar i nedförsbacke
    https://allmanmedicin.sfam.se/p/all...snobollar-i-nedforsbacke/1919/584871/31111895
     
    Trish, Kalliope and Andy like this.
  11. mango

    mango Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,522
    Opinion piece in a local Swedish paper.

    ME-patienter behöver tas på allvar – nu
    https://www.lt.se/2022-11-18/me-patienter-behover-tas-pa-allvar--nu
     
    RedFox, Kalliope, Sean and 4 others like this.
  12. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    6,274
    Location:
    Norway
    Yesterday there was a debate about ME in the Norwegian Parliament and these two propositions got a majority of votes (google translated):

    - The Parliament asks the Government to go review regulations and practice to ensure that CFS/ME sufferers right to equal treatment is safeguarded in view of demands for appropriate treatment when applying for disability benefits

    - The Parliament asks the Government to review regulations and practice to ensure that CFS/ME sufferers during clarification are not subject to requirements for treatment that is unavailable, or are refused in the public healthcare system

    Patient advocate Sissel Sunde has written a thorough article about the history leading up to this:
    Historisk dag for ME-syke
    google translation: Historical day for ME sufferers
     
    John Mac, Sean, RedFox and 7 others like this.
  13. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    6,274
    Location:
    Norway
    New article from the Norwegian broadcaster NRK about 25 year old Aurora who suffers from severe ME and now has lived against her will in a care institution for old people for over nine months. Local politicians are now asking the municipality to do something. Her wish is to move back home and receive the care she needs there.

    NRK: Ber helsebyråden gripe inn og hjelpe Aurora: - Burde satt inn alle kluter
    google translation: Asks the health board to intervene and help Aurora: - Should have done everything in their power

    Aurora is also on Twitter and has written a thread about her stay at the institution, where the health care workers there obviously lack even a basic understanding of ME and some even are annoyed at her, leaving her very vulnerable.

     
  14. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    5,076
    I’m afraid I am not exactly sure what these propositions say. They might be useful for other countries to refer to but I’d like to be sure I know what they mean.

    Who is refusing the treatment in the second proposition? Is it saying a patient has a right to refuse treatment and it shouldn’t affect their right to get disability payments? Or is it saying if the public health system refuses to offer the treatment, the patient can’t be blamed for not having done it?
     
  15. Midnattsol

    Midnattsol Moderator Staff Member

    Messages:
    3,597
    Not ME but MS, I found the focus on disease mechanism quite nice...

    Google translate: International researchers propose a new definition of the disease MS

     
    inox, Louie41, Lilas and 6 others like this.
  16. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    6,274
    Location:
    Norway
    Am a bit confused myself.

    The first proposition I believe is an answer to what the research project "TjenestenogMEg" has revealed, that case workers have been asked to be specifically thorough when patients with ME or with drug/alcohol addiction applies for disability benefits.

    The second proposition is a bit confusing. Perhaps it means that an ME patient can't be asked to undergo psychological therapy if no therapists see the point.
     
  17. Solstice

    Solstice Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    1,159
    The stigma around ME is known to us mostly, most people know little about the disease. Most people do know something suffering from addiction, what I never understood is the need to be punitive towards those people.

    I've worked at a social work institution where some of my co-workers were there through a program could arbeidsactivering, activate people to work again. Some of the addicted people went of the rails and they were subsequently cut from welfare.

    The logic in that completely escapes me, because those people aren't suddenly going to quit needing food, housing and ultimately their hit of whatever. They'll just find other ways to get it, ways that end up costing society a lot more. I don't think people should get punished for addiction but views can differ on that. But even when looking at it from a pragmatic view-point this makes no sense to me whatsoever and it ends up costing a lot more too in economical terms.
     
    Andy, Midnattsol, Louie41 and 6 others like this.
  18. mango

    mango Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,522
  19. mango

    mango Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    2,522
    (Paywalled) Johanna, 49, om att leva med ME – och kampen för att få rätt vård: ”Som en konstig mardröm”
    https://www.jp.se/2022-12-05/johann...n-for-att-fa-ratt-vard-som-en-konstig-mardrom
     
    RedFox and Peter Trewhitt like this.
  20. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

    Messages:
    12,421
    Location:
    Canada
    Ironic, but this is one of the darkest truths with the continued obsession with psychosomatics, it not only ruined medicine's ability to deal with chronic illness, it also effectively made all efforts related to mental health so much worse that they amount to nothing, they ended up mixing so many different things in there that the whole thing could be restarted from scratch and nothing of value would be lost.

    Even the data recorded so far are so incomplete and misleading that it amounts to nothing. While they essentially mock suffering they create themselves. Truly the lowest point in the history of the profession: the era where snake oil was made official, ending any separation between science and pseudoscience.
     
    Peter Trewhitt likes this.

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