The biology of coronavirus COVID-19 - including research and treatments

Discussion in 'Epidemics (including Covid-19, not Long Covid)' started by Trish, Mar 12, 2020.

  1. JaneL

    JaneL Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    A phase 1/2 trial of the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine was started in July looking at how the vaccine works in people who are HIV positive compared to people are are HIV negative:
    https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04444674

    I learnt that from Hilda Bastian’s very helpful timeline of the Oxford-AstraZeneca Covid-19 vaccine trials:
    http://hildabastian.net/index.php/100
     
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  2. FMMM1

    FMMM1 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Yip standard advice for policy folks:
    1) evidence based policy development - that's the official Government stance;
    2) policy based evidence development - your Minister wants something done --- go "develop" the evidence base!
     
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  3. hinterland

    hinterland Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Is there any reason to believe that the dysregulated (upregulated) RNase-L pathway that has been reported in ME/CFS would make an mRNA vaccine less effective?

    https://me-pedia.org/wiki/Ribonuclease_L
     
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  4. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  5. Wits_End

    Wits_End Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    So, the UK is to be the first country to administer the Pfizer vaccine, and they even had Clare Gerada on the news tonight telling a couple of people with queries how safe it was. I feel so reassured ...

    EDIT: Also, this seems a bit odd, and doesn't fill me with confidence. Is it common for producers of new vaccines to be indemnified against legal action if the vaccine has any nasty effects on anyone?
    http://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknew...government/ar-BB1bzBv0?ocid=ASUDHP&li=BBoPWjQ
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2020
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  6. Amw66

    Amw66 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Does anyone know what the adjuvant is?
     
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  7. Snow Leopard

    Snow Leopard Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    The Pfizer vaccine doesn't contain a separate adjuvant. It is simply the mRNA gene for the spike protein with a (proprietary) lipid coating (so that the mRNA survives long enough to be transcribed).
     
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  8. Binkie4

    Binkie4 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    @snowleopard
    I haven't understood this fully. Do we know yet what is likely to be needed in terms of follow up doses after the initial two doses? And for which vaccine?
     
  9. Amw66

    Amw66 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thanks , that's good to know
    I was thinking more of the astra zeneca one - as it is more " traditional " ?
     
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  10. FMMM1

    FMMM1 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    There's a BBC Radio 4 program "How to vaccinate the world" which might help to provide some insight - a lot of these questions can't be answered yet --- once you've vaccinated a few million people, and time has elapsed, then you'll presumably have evidence of whether boosters are required and after what time period.
     
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  11. hinterland

    hinterland Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I'd like to know the answer on this too. Perhaps the adenovirus vector is sufficiently immunogenic that an additional adjuvant isn't needed??
     
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  12. Binkie4

    Binkie4 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thanks @FMMM1.

    Do you have time details for the programme. Sounds interesting.
     
  13. MeSci

    MeSci Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  14. Binkie4

    Binkie4 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  15. FMMM1

    FMMM1 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Just Google "Radio 4 Schedule" - you can access them via this link as well*:

    Episode 3
    How to Vaccinate the World
    Tim Harford reports on what we know and don't know about the Oxford/Astra Zeneca Covid 19 vaccine with a panel of experts.
    *https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m000py6x
     
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  16. Snow Leopard

    Snow Leopard Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    We do not know yet. It really depends on whether the virus develops sufficient variation in the epitope region in 3-5 years - similar to the difference between flu strains for example, would require re-vaccination. I strongly suspect the vaccine induced antibodies will last at least 5 years, like most other vaccines.

    The AstraZeneca vaccine is not in the least "traditional", as it uses an adenovirus vector - there are no currently approved vaccines like this at all.

    The purpose of an adjuvant is additional immune system stimulation against foreign antigens. This would actually harm the efficacy of viral vector vaccines and mRNA (or DNA) vaccines since the vector would be eliminated by the immune system before it is able to be transcribed!

    Adjuvants are typically used for subunit vaccines.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5084984/
     
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  17. Amw66

    Amw66 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Thank you
     
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  18. Binkie4

    Binkie4 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  19. Amw66

    Amw66 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  20. Snow Leopard

    Snow Leopard Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    To put it as an obscure analogy: you need to make two trips and your vehicle choices are a Ferrari Portofino and a Morris Marina.

    These people are therefore arguing that one trip in a Morris Marina, the second trip in a Ferrari is cheaper than two trips in a Ferrari. Plus you still have the enjoyable experience of one trip in a Ferrari, rather than two mediocre trips in a Morris Marina, with risk of not getting to your destination on the second trip due to unreliability.
     

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