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Trial By Error: An Open Letter to Dr Godlee about BMJ’s Ethically Bankrupt Actions

Discussion in 'General ME/CFS news' started by Andy, Aug 28, 2019.

  1. Barry

    Barry Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Well stuffed there then on all levels.
     
    alktipping and MEMarge like this.
  2. Simbindi

    Simbindi Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    When I was going through my divorce and had to discuss some of my ex's quite extreme behaviours with my solicitor, he warned me to 'not involve a psychiatrist' unless absolutely necessary. He then said they had a well-used joke in the legal profession that you could only tell the psychiatrist from their patient by which one held the keys to the medicine cabinet. I always thought that statement was 'a thing of beauty', coming as it did from a lawyer!
     
    Last edited: Sep 16, 2019
    bobbler, John Mac, oldtimer and 16 others like this.
  3. NelliePledge

    NelliePledge Moderator Staff Member

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    That would be excellent.
     
  4. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Open Letter to Dr Godlee about BMJ's Ethically Bankrupt Actions (2)
    In July, I sent Dr Fiona Godlee, editorial director of BMJ, a letter signed by 55 experts about her company’s perplexing decision to republish the originally reported–and unreliable–findings from the trial of the Lightning Process. She did not respond. This morning I sent the letter again, with more individual signatories along with dozens of patient and advocacy groups.

    ETA signed by 72 individual academics and 65 advocacy groups/patient organisations :thumbup:
     
    alktipping, Chezboo, Hutan and 17 others like this.
  5. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    https://twitter.com/user/status/1197978723200335872
     
    alktipping, rainy, andypants and 13 others like this.
  6. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Weird interactions from the quacks (likely Vogt) at recoverynorge trying to promote their anecdotes on LP below the first tweet by Tuller. No idea what's the point, but first I've seen of them responding so something must be happening somewhere that is having an impact on their PR campaign.
     
    alktipping, Sisyphus, Barry and 6 others like this.
  7. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  8. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    The fact that after 30+ years of this type of treatment all there ever is a few anecdotes is the biggest tell in the damn universe. It's been in official practice for 20+ years in some places. Dozens of trials. Still with the anecdotes. Only anecdotes. All anecdotes all the time because the trials always end up showing it doesn't lead to any significant improvement and outcomes in practice are so catastrophic multiple national legislative assemblies, and one government, independently acknowledged it and called for reform.

    So we have this pattern of cheating and lying, Crawley is a repeat offender. And it was recently reported by a participant in a precursor trial to PACE, one that was a proof of concept to support funding PACE and had to show positive results for PACE to be funded, also cheated to bury evidence of serious deterioration by some mathemagic where they took means and averages instead of individual results. I'm not the least bit surprised but this means all the cheating and switching and manipulation that the PACE team did was also done in precursor trials, without which PACE would likely not have been funded.

    This is serious financial fraud. There is also no reason why PACE was so richly funded. It had very mediocre potential, with zero prior objective evidence of significant improvement, and could have been done as is for 1/10th of the price without changing anything other than being more impressive by merely being expensive. That's another pattern of deception, not following rules and being exempted of requirements by arbitrary decisions.

    Patterns of behavior are revealing. Every one of those trials failed in practice. This is beyond evident: zero significant improvement reported. There was ample cheating to pretend otherwise, to get funding and put into official practice a treatment model that failed every single test it had. This is a massive regulatory failure, a total breakdown of ethics and even legal requirements about medical research and practice.

    This insanity has to end. It is anathema to the mission of medicine and at this point, with this much evidence, amounts to criminal negligence.
     
  9. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

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    Yep. Complete and utter failure. Simply no way around that.
     
    alktipping, MEMarge, Webdog and 4 others like this.
  10. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Trial By Error: More Calls to Godlee for LP study Retraction

    Last last month, I resent Dr Fiona Godlee a letter criticizing BMJ’s decision to republish the Lightning Process study with the same findings. The first iteration, in July, was signed by 55 scientists, clinicians and other experts. This version was signed by more than 70 experts and over 60 patient and advocacy organizations. After I sent the previous version, more than a dozen of the signatories followed up with letters of their own to Dr Godlee.

    Below are two more recent ones. The first is from my Berkeley colleague, infectious disease professor emeritus John Swartzberg, who is also editorial director of the Berkeley Wellness Letter and BerkeleyWellness.com. The second is from Dr Susan Taylor-Brown, a retired pediatrician at Golisano Children’s Hospital at the University of Rochester.
     
    sea, 2kidswithME, rvallee and 16 others like this.
  11. ScottTriGuy

    ScottTriGuy Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    "...
    This study appears to be the contemporary example of a poorly designed, unethical research study that fails to protect pediatric subjects. This study will be used as an exemplar of poorly designed and implemented research. As researchers, we are to do no harm; the Lightning Process fails to protect children and must be retracted.

    Sincerely,

    Susan Taylor-Brown, PhD
    "
     
    alktipping, MEMarge, Andy and 10 others like this.
  12. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    It's going to be kinda neat when people have to face the facts of who the LP guy, tarot diagnosis and healing hands quack, and what it alleges to do, including curing MS and other serious diseases. It's a whole package when you invite it in. Though cherry-picking may be standard, even mandatory, with BPS, it is not how any of this works.

    All this defense and hostility at anyone suggesting it may even possibly be flawed in the slightest. For this mediocre garbage. Promoted implicitly and explicitly by the British Medical Association and the Science Media "we teach about fake news" Center.

    All I picture in my mind is the hotel room morning after scene from Fear & loathing in Las Vegas. Except Hunter S Thompson was much smarter and wiser than any of these fools and probably had a better understanding of human nature.

    [​IMG]
     
    alktipping and ScottTriGuy like this.
  13. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Ariel, EzzieD, JohnM and 9 others like this.
  14. Snowdrop

    Snowdrop Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  15. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Here it's pretty much "Mistakes will continue to be made".

    Though if only it were just mistakes and not abdication of all basic responsibilities in the face of blatant fraud and despite horrible outcomes.

    Getting a bit numb over how little accountability there is in medicine. There is basically none at all. Even coming from a field where accountability is notoriously lacking, medicine seems to have serious issues with basic accountability, preferring to double down on disasters.
     
    Ariel, Peter Trewhitt, obeat and 7 others like this.
  16. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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  17. Caroline Struthers

    Caroline Struthers Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    From Wikipedia....

    Despite some mockery of the phrase, its use is still widespread, and in the opinion of one commentator, "the type of evasive and corrupted language for which Ron Ziegler was repeatedly pilloried for using as Nixon's press secretary is not only accepted, but heartily and shamelessly embraced as a norm of political and social conduct."
     
  18. Kalliope

    Kalliope Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Don't know if this is the best thread for these news, but the BMJ has just announced that Fiona Godlee is resigning at the end of this year.

    BMJ Fiona Godlee to step down as the BMJ's editor in chief

    Quote:
    “BMJ is heading into a new and exciting phase of its development, so it’s the right time for new leadership. Hard though it is to give up something you love, I’ll be leaving the journal in excellent hands. I look forward to exploring new opportunities that continue my interests in improving health and protecting the environment.”
     
  19. Revel

    Revel Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Last edited: Nov 10, 2021
  20. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

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    @dave30th this might be of interest.
     

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