HPV vaccination and risk of ME/CFS

I had neither a fever or typical viral-like illness - just rapid onset severe fatigue and severe weakness in my lower limbs.

 

To make things worse, its entirely possible its the cumulative impact that leads to ME, and that none of these things are specifically responsible, for at least some patients. These kinds of confounds are very hard to tease out of data. Studies need to be specifically designed to find these things. We have lacked decent epidemiology in ME and CFS since the beginning, despite numerous calls for funding. Instead what we got were endless rounds of prevalence surveys, using different definitions.

 

Since I had my Hep B vaccines during the same time period as my classmates, I can say that 2 people got sick soon after. One person had to take one week off classes while the other had severe stomach issues. They recovered. My reaction soon (a few days) after the second jab was loss of stamina and gut issues. I never recovered, my anti-thyroid antibodies shot up and the initial viral onset vertigo struck back again.

 

I don’t see how it can be wise to give multiple vaccinations at the same time.. I’m not anti-vaccination but if you are asking for an immune response, surely it has to be sensible to be cautious - and that means one thing at a time. That’s my beef with the MMR..

Do we know that vaccinations at puberty are as risk-free as at other ages?

 

TWiV have just done an episode on this very topic... http://www.microbe.tv/twiv/twiv-496/

Good discussion of the issues, including safety, adverse reactions etc.

 

A vaccine for multiple viruses in the same needle is likely to be safer than vaccines for those same viruses administered at separate times. Each one is a new independent event to stimulate the immune system (especially so if adjuvants are involved).

My opinion after reviewing the data on autoimmune consequences after vaccine administration is that puberty is riskier than early childhood. The events are still rare, but they are extremely rare in early childhood.

 

From new thread on PR

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tP-Th9Ug_vg

 

After 10 years of free HPV vaccines for young girls in Norway, it was reported earlier this week that the number of cervical cancer cases have been significantly reduced. Should have a link, but can’t manage right now.

Has nothing to do with ME-risk, but it certainly is an argument in favor of the vaccine.

 

Probably not important, but I rarely come across CFS being mentioned so prominently

https://assets.publishing.service.g...PHE_HPV_healthcare_professional_factsheet.pdf
https://www.woodcotehigh.com/wp-con...PV-Vaccination-Programme-Information-2020.pdf

 

Digital Public Defence: Berit Feiring
Cand.pharm Berit Feiring at Institute of Health and Society will be defending the thesis “HPV vaccination in Norway: Uptake, safety and effectiveness” for the degree of PhD (Philosophiae Doctor).

Time and place: May 6, 2020 11:15 AM, Zoom

full details here
https://www.med.uio.no/helsam/engli.../disputations/2020/berit-feiring-digital.html

 

Is there such a way to get such a vaccine in the UK? I don’t know what it was that over stimulates my immune system - do flu vaccines have adjuvants? Sorry to be off topic.

I have recently been quite worried about the coronavirus vaccine. I know I would need it to keep me safe. However it is in my medical notes that I have had severe relapses and adverse reactions after vaccination, 2 times with flu vaccine since I became ill with ME. The last time, I got hives all over my body, became feverish and very unwell, severe relapse from which I still haven’t gone back to pre-vaccine levels (which was still severe but not as bad as now - I was walking quite a few steps before the relapse).

Ive not had proper advice as to what I should/could do about future vaccines.

 

I agree, @lunarainbows. I'm also very reactive to vaccines: I was given a "vaccine challenge" by an immunologist a few years ago, and my bloods showed a massively abnormal inflammatory response to it (extremely high CRP levels, ESR and something called Serum Amyloid). For this reason, I can't have the flu jab, so I have to make sure people close to me all get it "on my behalf". I ask my teenage kids to get it too, so they can act as a buffer.

For me, the risk of getting the virus would have to be reasonable (at least non-negligible) to justify the hit I would have to take by having the vaccine.

Of course, you have to take into account that, when a vaccine does become available, that will change the population-wide COVID landscape quite significantly, the risk of catching the virus is likely to down steeply.

 

Meanwhile, the evidence for stress/anxiety/fear/whatever being the cause of chronic illness: "uh, why not? like, can you prove that it's not?"

Pretty much literally. This double standard is infuriating.

 

Suppose someone has an excruciating illness of some kind and it isn't curable or easily diagnosed, then surely stress (from being in pain) and/or anxiety (will the pain get worse? will I get any help?) and/or fear (if I don't get cured there is nothing to stop the pain from getting worse) will go up. This is likely to raise cortisol, one of the stress hormones.

Suppose a child is abused, physically, emotionally, mentally - their cortisol levels will rise too.

Suppose someone is severely iron deficient. It causes all sorts of symptoms that will make life more difficult and hence more stressful. Cortisol levels might rise as a result.

Suppose someone gets flu and recovers without any lingering problems. I'm not sure what their cortisol levels would do, but they would almost certainly revert to normal after recovery.

The problem with stress/anxiety/fear is that they can develop from all sorts of causes that might not be easily cured, or diagnosed, or brought to an end. But doctors and therapists usually only believe in one possible cause - mental illness. So people are likely to be offered CBT and anti-depressants.

CBT and anti-depressants don't actually stop child abuse, nor do they repair an iron deficiency.

Excruciating illness which is difficult to diagnose and/or for which there is no cure is not likely to be helped by CBT and anti-depressants either - ask anyone who develops ME.