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News about Long Covid including its relationship to ME/CFS 2020 to 2021

Discussion in 'Long Covid news' started by Hip, Jan 21, 2020.

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  1. Wits_End

    Wits_End Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I think you'll probably find that "gallows humour" is a coping strategy for many medical professions.
     
    Wits_End, Jun 30, 2020
    #541
    Invisible Woman, 2kidswithME, Trish and 2 others like this.
  2. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

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    I used to work in the medical system, including in the wards and dealing with patients and medical staff every day, and socialising with the staff after hours, and I get why they need to do gallows humour. If they didn't they would go mad with shock and grief. None of them would last in the job.

    I understand why it looks bad to outsiders, and I am not excusing every instance of it. Sometimes they go too far and let their prejudice over ride basic decency and professional ethics, like they often do with ME/CFS patients, and they have to be held to account for it.

    But I get why it happens.
     
    Sean, Jun 30, 2020
    #542
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  3. mango

    mango Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I'm not sure if the expression "gallows humour" is used differently in English, but in Swedish "gallows humor" means making "dark jokes" about your own miserable situation, or about yourself. "Gallows humour" is different from "put-down humour", it's not about making jokes at the expense of someone else, it's not about kicking someone when they are down.

    Adding to clarify: I wouldn't call what they are doing "gallows humor". Their so called "jokes" are clearly not about themselves as doctors, but about their patients.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020
    mango, Jun 30, 2020
    #543
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  4. Sean

    Sean Moderator Staff Member

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    That is possible.
     
    Sean, Jun 30, 2020
    #544
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  5. Sarah94

    Sarah94 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    So we have stats showing that around 10% of covid patients still have symptoms after 3 weeks. But do we have stats for a longer time period than that?? 3 weeks isn't very long. I'm more concerned to know how many still have symptoms after a month or so.

    Either way, it's still obviously very early days though.

    With glandular fever it is fairly normal for post viral fatigue to last a couple of months.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020
    Sarah94, Jun 30, 2020
    #545
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  6. lunarainbows

    lunarainbows Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    And it may be that we need to also follow them up up to a year or two later too. I “recovered” from my viral infection for up to 8 months. And then started going downhill again after 8 months.. very slowly at first, I hardly realised.. then it got very bad very quickly. All in all it took 1 year and 4 months after my viral infection; for my ME to be diagnosed as ME and to become severe. (If I had been diagnosed when mild, maybe I would say I could have been diagnosed with mild ME at around 10-11 months after infection). My infection was suspected to be HHV6, from blood tests, a cousin of EBV.
     
    lunarainbows, Jun 30, 2020
    #546
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  7. lunarainbows

    lunarainbows Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    lunarainbows, Jun 30, 2020
    #547
    ladycatlover, Invisible Woman, Hutan and 11 others like this.
  8. Robert 1973

    Robert 1973 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Robert 1973, Jun 30, 2020
    #548
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  9. Trish

    Trish Moderator Staff Member

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    Trish, Jun 30, 2020
    #549
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  10. chrisb

    chrisb Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I once followed up that quote and it seemed to have been directed at J Gordon Parish.

    Those familiar with Osler's Web will recall that Parish was also treated with disdain at the Holme's conference discussing the criteria for CFS. He did not deserve this treatment.

    EDIT added omitted word
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2020
    chrisb, Jun 30, 2020
    #550
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  11. Mithriel

    Mithriel Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I felt this was my experience and I noted it in a lot of people I knew in the days before CFS. It makes me wonder if the mild symptoms are because the virus evades the immune system so it gets deep into the body. Then the disease can become long term for the same reason.

    Also, if you have milder symptoms it is easier to do too much causing more damage than if you are forced to rest because you feel so bad.

    (I say before CFS because after that there were more people with EBV where they were very ill right from the beginning. EBV works differently in the body from other viruses.)
     
    Mithriel, Jun 30, 2020
    #551
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  12. Robert 1973

    Robert 1973 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    I see that Paul Garner’s blog is the most read article on the BMJ Opion website. It has over 8,840 shares on Facebook. The second most read article has 1,350 share and the third has 120. I hope this may alert the BMJ to the importance of these issues he raises.

    Please keep sharing. And please upvote my comment on the BMJ site so that more people see it.
     
    Robert 1973, Jun 30, 2020
    #552
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  13. rvallee

    rvallee Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    It's not even correct, though. It's the people sentenced to the gallows who make humor about their own predicament, not the ones leading them there or guarding them.

    On COVID-19, doctors have legitimate grievances that can be leveled at authorities. There should be. That's punching up, aka holding authorities responsible. Mocking patients is punching down. This is what bullies do and it has nothing to do with gallows humor.

    Have they considered yoga? Maybe they should take their own advice and do some yoga, it will do some good for their anger. Or maybe some mindfulness, or perhaps some CBT. Punching down on vulnerable people is just grotesque, even more so in a position of statutory authority.
     
    rvallee, Jun 30, 2020
    #553
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  14. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    https://www.chicagotribune.com/coro...0200630-cge3ve6y6zbh3p7pxd3tdcjrua-story.html


    It's a pity this keeps getting reported:
     
    Dolphin, Jul 1, 2020
    #554
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  15. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    http://cuphysioresearch.coventry.do...-it-change-perceptions-about-chronic-fatigue/
     
    Dolphin, Jul 1, 2020
    #555
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  16. Jaybee00

    Jaybee00 Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Jaybee00, Jul 2, 2020
    #556
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  17. Mij

    Mij Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    The article does mention PICS (Post Intensive Care Syndrome).
     
    Mij, Jul 2, 2020
    #557
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  18. Andy

    Andy Committee Member

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    US: Coronavirus Patient And His Doctor Explain ‘Long-Haul’ Symptoms | TODAY
    Copy and paste this link
    Code:
    https://youtu.be/GTTx6nNMiuU?t=301
    to jump to the section where the doctor mentions PEM and ME/CFS.
     
    Andy, Jul 2, 2020
    #558
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  19. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    Source: Voice of America
    Date: July 1, 2020
    URL: https://www.voazimbabwe.com/a/coronavirus-covid-19/5485093.html

     
    Dolphin, Jul 2, 2020
    #559
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  20. Dolphin

    Dolphin Senior Member (Voting Rights)

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    https://www.healthcentral.com/article/long-term-effects-coronavirus


     
    Dolphin, Jul 2, 2020
    #560
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